Add option for specific ordering of passives to the breeding calculator

[ayellowlizard]

Taken from the Palworld Wiki:

Yakumo is able to increase the chance to encounter Pals with the same passive skills. The order of Yakumo's passives matters, with the first being most likely to appear in the wild Pal as the first passive, then Yakumo's second passive as the wild Pal's second, and so on. Passives that can't appear randomly, such as Lucky, aren't affected by Yakumo's effect, and are skipped when matching the wild Pal's passives.

Would it be possible to add an option for ordering the passives? For example, my current Yakumo has:

1. Demon God
2. Serenity
   3/4 empty/misc passives

But I'd love to have one with:
1/2 empty/misc passives
3. Demon God
4. Serenity

Thank you so much for developing this mod. I can't understate how helpful it's been for breeding haha.

[tylercamp]

This is interesting, and I'm mixed on whether to add it. It's sort of like #14 where it could be accounted for but it would just affect the final pal and therefore not have much value. You could take any breeding tree and just keep trying until you get the result you want..

However, this ordering property would be affected by the parents, unlike #14 which has a fixed probability.

For your specific example, it would be best for the parents to have 4 total unique passives:

• Palworld first adds directly-inherited passives (1-4), then adds random passives (0-3)
• If less than 4 unique passives are available from the parents, then the 4th slot would never be one of the direct passives from the parents
• More than 4 passives make it less likely that Demon God and Serenity would be inherited, so exactly 4 would be preferred

Here I recommend 4 total unique passives, but the recommendation will change depending on how many you want inherited and where you want them.

This seems appropriate for Pal Calc to solve for.

[tylercamp]

But I'd love to have one with:
1/2 empty/misc passives
3. Demon God
4. Serenity

Was there a typo on this? The Palworld wiki makes it sound like your desired pal would be less likely to pass on Demon God and Serenity

I'd expect users to want those passives up front so they're more likely to be obtained. In that case the logic I described above would be unnecessary

[ayellowlizard]

But I'd love to have one with:
1/2 empty/misc passives
3. Demon God
4. Serenity

Was there a typo on this? The Palworld wiki makes it sound like your desired pal would be less likely to pass on Demon God and Serenity

I'd expect users to want those passives up front so they're more likely to be obtained. In that case the logic I described above would be unnecessary

I'm not entirely sure on this, but I assume since the Palworld wiki said such-and-such about the order of passives, I thought it might be better (for catching legendaries) to put the passives at the back so that Lord of X and Legend don't conflict with it. Absolutely correct me if I'm wrong.

[ayellowlizard]

This is interesting, and I'm mixed on whether to add it. It's sort of like #14 where it could be accounted for but it would just affect the final pal and therefore not have much value. You could take any breeding tree and just keep trying until you get the result you want..

However, this ordering property would be affected by the parents, unlike #14 which has a fixed probability.

For your specific example, it would be best for the parents to have 4 total unique passives:

* Palworld first adds directly-inherited passives (1-4), _then_ adds random passives (0-3)

* If less than 4 unique passives are available from the parents, then the 4th slot would never be one of the direct passives from the parents

* More than 4 passives make it less likely that Demon God and Serenity would be inherited, so exactly 4 would be preferred

Here I recommend 4 total unique passives, but the recommendation will change depending on how many you want inherited and where you want them.

This seems appropriate for Pal Calc to solve for.

Thank you!! :D/

[tylercamp]

The passives don't replace set ones like Legend or Divine dragon, so you can get a good roll on a boss fairly quickly with some patience.

This comment from palworld.wiki.gg suggests that they shouldn't interfere with guaranteed passives

But the original reddit thread referenced there says:

I was using a 2 star Yakumo who's passives were lucky, artisan, and serious

After catching 3 boxes of pals they all had a random passive first, artisan was common as the second (and only appeared as second), and most with a third passive had serious. Also artisan was always in second when they had serious.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Palworld/s/IEPxGhCd7N

This isn't quite the same though, since the special passives were on the Yakumo instead of the wild pals. The wiki doesn't have a source for the first quote

[ayellowlizard]

The passives don't replace set ones like Legend or Divine dragon, so you can get a good roll on a boss fairly quickly with some patience.

This comment from palworld.wiki.gg suggests that they shouldn't interfere with guaranteed passives

But the original reddit thread referenced there says:

I was using a 2 star Yakumo who's passives were lucky, artisan, and serious
After catching 3 boxes of pals they all had a random passive first, artisan was common as the second (and only appeared as second), and most with a third passive had serious. Also artisan was always in second when they had serious.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Palworld/s/IEPxGhCd7N

This isn't quite the same though, since the special passives were on the Yakumo instead of the wild pals. The wiki doesn't have a source for the first quote

Yup. I thought since slot 1 and 2 were already taken, I might as well have Yakumo's passives in slot 3 and 4 in case Yakumo's passives were being 'replaced' with the 20% skill + legend passives. That's only a hypothesis though, since so far I've had bad luck with the Demon God + Serenity Yakumo. Caught at least 7 Jetragons by now and none of them have Yakumo's passives.

[tylercamp]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Palworld/s/l1zYd1kAza

https://www.reddit.com/r/Palworld/s/H860v3ClzP

(Think this screenshot is from paldb.cc but I'm on mobile and cant do mouse-hover popups)

This gives us exact percentages, I assume each passive gets its own roll for whether it's synced rather than a roll for num synced? Can the third passive sync but the first or second don't?

[ayellowlizard]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Palworld/s/l1zYd1kAza

https://www.reddit.com/r/Palworld/s/H860v3ClzP

(Think this screenshot is from paldb.cc but I'm on mobile and cant do mouse-hover popups)

This gives us exact percentages, I assume each passive gets its own roll for whether it's synced rather than a roll for num synced? Can the third passive sync but the first or second don't?

I tested it some more (I have a page of alpha jetragons I caught) and it appears I was wrong. Discount that, I think I just had bad luck. They definitely can pass down. I couldn't tell if the ordering of the passives affected the odds of it appearing on my jetragons though - I bred a Yakumo with these passives:

1. Runner
2. Infinite Stamina
3. Swift
4. Eternal Engine

And they all seemed to appear on my Jetragons with basically the same odds. But it's only a page of jetragons, so not a very large sample size.

[tylercamp]

@ayellowlizard Ah ok, keep me updated if you keep running this experiment

Even if the specific slot positions aren't synced (e.g. slot 1 -> slot 1, slot 2 -> slot 2), I'd still expect Yakumo passives in earlier slots to appear slightly more often when capturing wild pals with guaranteed passives. If there are only two free slots, and 3 or more passives from Yakumo are synced, only the first two would be included and the others would be skipped (probably? assuming they're just rolling + adding passives until the list gets filled)

---

I didn't feel like sorting out those probabilities manually, so I asked ChatGPT o1 and it gave a pretty reasonable response (15% probability is base effectiveness, 30% is condensed to rank 5):

Wild Pal has 1 guaranteed passive (3 free slots)

Passive	15% Probability	30% Probability
P1	15.00%	30.00%
P2	15.00%	30.00%
P3	15.00%	30.00%
P4	14.95%	29.19%

---

Wild Pal has 2 guaranteed passives (2 free slots)

Passive	15% Probability	30% Probability
P1	15.00%	30.00%
P2	15.00%	30.00%
P3	14.66%	27.30%
P4	14.09%	23.52%

---

Wild Pal has 3 guaranteed passives (1 free slot)

Passive	15% Probability	30% Probability
P1	15.00%	30.00%
P2	12.75%	21.00%
P3	10.84%	14.70%
P4	9.21%	10.29%

---

I could also add an option to include catching with Yakumo into the probabilities though, the only complication is the amount of time taken to capture each wild pal. There's a rough estimate right now but we'd probably want to let users specify how long each capture will take

[tylercamp]

(The above probability tables aren't guaranteed to be correct, but if Palworld is just doing a basic process of "roll + add until passives are filled", then I'd expect something like this)

[ayellowlizard]

@ayellowlizard Ah ok, keep me updated if you keep running this experiment

Even if the specific slot positions aren't synced (e.g. slot 1 -> slot 1, slot 2 -> slot 2), I'd still expect Yakumo passives in earlier slots to appear slightly more often when capturing wild pals with guaranteed passives. If there are only two free slots, and 3 or more passives from Yakumo are synced, only the first two would be included and the others would be skipped (probably? assuming they're just rolling + adding passives until the list gets filled)

I didn't feel like sorting out those probabilities manually, so I asked ChatGPT o1 and it gave a pretty reasonable response (15% probability is base effectiveness, 30% is condensed to rank 5):

Wild Pal has 1 guaranteed passive (3 free slots)

Passive 15% Probability 30% Probability
P1 15.00% 30.00%
P2 15.00% 30.00%
P3 15.00% 30.00%
P4 14.95% 29.19%

Wild Pal has 2 guaranteed passives (2 free slots)

Passive 15% Probability 30% Probability
P1 15.00% 30.00%
P2 15.00% 30.00%
P3 14.66% 27.30%
P4 14.09% 23.52%

Wild Pal has 3 guaranteed passives (1 free slot)

Passive 15% Probability 30% Probability
P1 15.00% 30.00%
P2 12.75% 21.00%
P3 10.84% 14.70%
P4 9.21% 10.29%

I could also add an option to include catching with Yakumo into the probabilities though, the only complication is the amount of time taken to capture each wild pal. There's a rough estimate right now but we'd probably want to let users specify how long each capture will take

If I ever continue, I'll make sure to keep you updated :)